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Thread: Cable----Lib Dems are a well kept secret.

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    Cable----Lib Dems are a well kept secret.

    No they aren't,everybody is well aware of what they are.............useless.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43639794
    Last edited by cromwell; 04-04-2018 at 05:11 PM. Reason: Fixing link
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    Well lets be honest,they are all hopeless cases,who have had a good run of ignoring the electorate and instead of representing them,have been ruling over them.The Lib Dems just being the farthest removed from the electorate.While the two party system still tells us through the media what they want us thinking and doing,which the electorate are more or less sick and tired of all of them.
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    The Lib Dems have chronically wounded themselves.

    They became a force to be reckoned with by hoovering up votes to the left of Labour, increasingly sick and tired of New Labour Thatcherism-lite, Tory housing policies continued, stagnating pay at the bottom, ever growing employment insecurity - and feck all meaningful being done about it! The Lib Dems also ever more monopolised the anti-Tory vote in areas where Labour were a distant third. 80% of Lib Dem voters, who gave them strength and over 50 MPs in spite of FPTP working against them, were left wing opponents of the Tory Party. Many were Labour supporters voting tactically Lib Dem to stop the Tories in their areas. Many others were refugees from New Labour looking for something more genuinely leftish - and less Thatcherite - to vote for. Hating the Tories was in their DNA.

    So when the Lib Dems actually jumped into bed with the Tories at the first opportunity, they effectively kicked 80% of their voters in the nuts, before doing the same to young people - the only age demographic where they were ahead of both other parties - by betraying them on tuition fees.

    It became rapidly obvious to everyone but the Lib Dems themselves - masters of self-delusion for five long years - that they were going to lose most of these voters as soon as another election was called, and they'd be slaughtered in consequence. When it actually happened they mostly looked stunned and shell-shocked, yet it should have been predictably obvious right from the very beginning, had they even made a cursory investigation into who was voting for them and why. It was obvious to most of the rest of us.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leftylib View Post
    The Lib Dems have chronically wounded themselves.

    They became a force to be reckoned with by hoovering up votes to the left of Labour, increasingly sick and tired of New Labour Thatcherism-lite, Tory housing policies continued, stagnating pay at the bottom, ever growing employment insecurity - and feck all meaningful being done about it! The Lib Dems also ever more monopolised the anti-Tory vote in areas where Labour were a distant third. 80% of Lib Dem voters, who gave them strength and over 50 MPs in spite of FPTP working against them, were left wing opponents of the Tory Party. Many were Labour supporters voting tactically Lib Dem to stop the Tories in their areas. Many others were refugees from New Labour looking for something more genuinely leftish - and less Thatcherite - to vote for. Hating the Tories was in their DNA.

    So when the Lib Dems actually jumped into bed with the Tories at the first opportunity, they effectively kicked 80% of their voters in the nuts, before doing the same to young people - the only age demographic where they were ahead of both other parties - by betraying them on tuition fees.

    It became rapidly obvious to everyone but the Lib Dems themselves - masters of self-delusion for five long years - that they were going to lose most of these voters as soon as another election was called, and they'd be slaughtered in consequence. When it actually happened they mostly looked stunned and shell-shocked, yet it should have been predictably obvious right from the very beginning, had they even made a cursory investigation into who was voting for them and why. It was obvious to most of the rest of us.
    You and I come from opposite sides of the political divide; always have done and probably always will do. However I think your interpretation on why the Liberal Democrats have totally collapsed is entirely correct, and with the spiteful, resentful and dribbling Vince Cable leading the LibDems they are not about to make any sort of recovery. We are back to a two party system with a vengeance with a massive gulf between the new Marxist orientated Labour and the right of centre Conservatives, with no indication as to how this gulf will be filled. Interesting times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leftylib View Post
    The Lib Dems have chronically wounded themselves.

    They became a force to be reckoned with by hoovering up votes to the left of Labour, increasingly sick and tired of New Labour Thatcherism-lite, Tory housing policies continued, stagnating pay at the bottom, ever growing employment insecurity - and feck all meaningful being done about it! The Lib Dems also ever more monopolised the anti-Tory vote in areas where Labour were a distant third. 80% of Lib Dem voters, who gave them strength and over 50 MPs in spite of FPTP working against them, were left wing opponents of the Tory Party. Many were Labour supporters voting tactically Lib Dem to stop the Tories in their areas. Many others were refugees from New Labour looking for something more genuinely leftish - and less Thatcherite - to vote for. Hating the Tories was in their DNA.

    So when the Lib Dems actually jumped into bed with the Tories at the first opportunity, they effectively kicked 80% of their voters in the nuts, before doing the same to young people - the only age demographic where they were ahead of both other parties - by betraying them on tuition fees.

    It became rapidly obvious to everyone but the Lib Dems themselves - masters of self-delusion for five long years - that they were going to lose most of these voters as soon as another election was called, and they'd be slaughtered in consequence. When it actually happened they mostly looked stunned and shell-shocked, yet it should have been predictably obvious right from the very beginning, had they even made a cursory investigation into who was voting for them and why. It was obvious to most of the rest of us.
    well, as i said, several times, in many threads , what was clegg to do ? prop up gordon brown in a two vote majority rainbow coalition that salmand demanded bribe after bribe to prop up....

    mind you, if you think they were hated in England, consider Wales where the two parties of English government 2010-15 we're the two parties of Welsh opposition...

    catfight !!
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    Lord Clyde: "Ayrshire Pullman Motor Services V Inland Revenue, 1929"

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    What was Clegg to do? Maybe not join a coalition but instead have an "understanding" with a minority government. Is that a little fanciful?
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    Quote Originally Posted by boggart View Post
    What was Clegg to do? Maybe not join a coalition but instead have an "understanding" with a minority government. Is that a little fanciful?
    With hindsight, this is probably exactly what the Lib Dems should have done. The problem with the Lib Dems is that they are too rational - they fail to understand that many people don't behave rationally and will, for example, be extremely susceptible to being steered into blaming the Lib Dems who only have a very small proportion of the seats in the coalition for the implementation of Tory policies.

    Also, with hindsight, they probably should have pulled out of the coalition when it became clear what the Tories were up to.

    You can see this type effect still happening today - the Lib Dems have 10%+ support amongst the population. However, their main policy right now is "exit from Brexit". According to recent reports, the BBC has issued reporting guidelines to its news programmes that effectively ban (censor?) them from reporting on the Brexit debate in terms of leave and remain - they are now only allowed to report on the ongoing negotiations. This effectively also bans them from reporting on Brexit protests, of which there are many still going on including large ones in London recently.

    The effect of this is that the Lib Dems are pushed out of the public sphere and everyone says they are irrelevant. It should also be remembered that the Lib Dems are pretty strong in local government in lots of areas around the country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Javert View Post
    With hindsight, this is probably exactly what the Lib Dems should have done. The problem with the Lib Dems is that they are too rational - they fail to understand that many people don't behave rationally and will, for example, be extremely susceptible to being steered into blaming the Lib Dems who only have a very small proportion of the seats in the coalition for the implementation of Tory policies.
    But for decades the LibDems have been pushing as their core policy a change in the voting system that would mean that coalition Government was inevitable. So if, at their first chance for a generation to show that coalition Government can be successful, they had refused to participate they would have become a laughing stock.

    The LibDems got exactly what they had been campaigning for for decades - a chance at power.

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    Quote Originally Posted by El Jefe View Post
    But for decades the LibDems have been pushing as their core policy a change in the voting system that would mean that coalition Government was inevitable. So if, at their first chance for a generation to show that coalition Government can be successful, they had refused to participate they would have become a laughing stock.

    The LibDems got exactly what they had been campaigning for for decades - a chance at power.
    Yes.

    But if coalition government was made likely by PR, other parties would behave in a different way than they might behave if they see the chance to get rid of the Lib Dems for about 2 decades under an FPTP system.

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