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Thread: Brexit tower thread (aka General brexit discussion)

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    Brexit tower thread (aka General brexit discussion)

    Bit like off topic tower thread but brexit posts not in line with the original post in a brexit thread,if that makes sense
    ​Cromwell.
    Well the UK will undoubtedly benefit!! A £multi-billion saving for a start....regaining it's democracy, via the restoration of and, legislative authority to it's elected Executive, and UK elected Parliament for endorsement.
    Oh yes - responsible border controls, fishing territorial rights, ( presumably)....AND, as a bonus, if the EU still retain the advantageous balance of trade with the UK,( more likely than not), then the UK Treasury WILL receive an income from the EU......... for a nice change!!
    Last edited by cromwell; 23-02-2018 at 01:33 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevlin View Post
    the UK Treasury WILL receive an income from the EU......... for a nice change!!
    not from the EU! from the UK consumer....

    Do you really still not understand how tariffs work?

    Once again..... the UK consumers will be paying the tariffs.

    A BMW will cost you 10% more than it would do and that 10% will go from your pocket to HMRC.

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    That's excellent. I'm all in favour of buyers of BMW, Audi, VW and Mercedes paying extra taxes. They can obviously afford it.
    New Brexit party seems OK

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    Quote Originally Posted by beelbeeb View Post
    not from the EU! from the UK consumer....

    Do you really still not understand how tariffs work?

    Once again..... the UK consumers will be paying the tariffs.

    A BMW will cost you 10% more than it would do and that 10% will go from your pocket to HMRC.
    I get your overall point, but experience shows the Germans will be able to adapt their pricing through efficiencies if required. Personal observation convinces me the same will be true of other EU manufacturers. It's exports from the UK into the EU that will be more likely to suffer...
    If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy — DD. The poster also reserves the right to amend or completely change any opinions he has posted at any time...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patman Post View Post
    I get your overall point, but experience shows the Germans will be able to adapt their pricing through efficiencies if required. Personal observation convinces me the same will be true of other EU manufacturers. It's exports from the UK into the EU that will be more likely to suffer...
    both BMW and Merc have profits before tax in the region of 10% (Merc 20115 revenue €150bn EBIT €13bn round numbers)

    Suggesting an average margin in the 10% range.

    Plus the bulk of German cars are premium brands so the extra cost is not so important (is a Merc buyer going to go for something else because the Merc is £55k not £50k?).

    So to cut the price of UK cars* to account for the 10% tariff would seem unlikely, though it is possible a small cut might happen, in which case a portion of the tariff revenue might be considered as "from the EU". However the UK consumer is still paying 10% more than they would have and that money is still going to HMRC.

    It is either dishonest or mistaken to say tariffs will raise money from the EU.

    *which probably cost a simdge more like for like as RHD cars are lower volume world wide. In addition IIRC current EU law allows consumers to order RHD from an EU dealer thus preventing too big a differential building up

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    That's excellent. I'm all in favour of buyers of BMW, Audi, VW and Mercedes paying extra taxes. They can obviously afford it.
    Well there is that view but it also applies to small French, Spanish, Slovakian and Italian cars like Citroen, SEAT, Skoda and Fiat, which are hardly for the super rich.

    It would also apply to "white vans" and only 1 is made in the UK (Vauxhall). So next time you see a white van that isn't a Vauxhall, that will cost another 10% too (25% if it's over 5t GVW).

    I think only DAF make trucks in UK, so the same applies to all those lorries you see hauling stuff around the UK. Of course DAF will face 25% tariff into the EU which won't help it in the cutthroat commercial haulage market...

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    Quote Originally Posted by beelbeeb View Post
    not from the EU! from the UK consumer....

    Do you really still not understand how tariffs work?

    Once again..... the UK consumers will be paying the tariffs.

    A BMW will cost you 10% more than it would do and that 10% will go from your pocket to HMRC.
    Well you appear to be the one without a clue!! Consumers, are ALSO taxpayers, and that tariff free 'bonus' that you appear to believe comes as a result of the largesse of the 'EU', but it actually comes at a heck of a price!!---and guess what? - it is the UK taxpayer that pays it!!
    Personally, I believe that it is is much fairer for the person who want's to buy an Audi, to do so at HIS/HER cost - instead of being subsidised by the taxpayer - many of whom can't even afford to buy a Ford - never mind helping to subsidise someone who can afford to buy a luxury car!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by beelbeeb View Post
    not from the EU! from the UK consumer....

    Do you really still not understand how tariffs work?


    A BMW will cost you 10% more than it would do and that 10% will go from your pocket to HMRC.
    Incidentally - it YOU actually realised how 'tariffs work', then even YOU would have realised that with duty being applied to imports , the EU exporters WOULD BE FUNDING THE UK TREASURY, instead of receiving a subsidy from it - IF, they continued to have the balance of trade - which, as it is 27 countries to one - it more than likely they will.
    Indeed - when importing 'foreign goods' - currently from outside of the EU, duties/taxes have to be paid to the UK customs , in order to have those goods put on sale in the country...... and yes, the importer will put that 'duty' on the product price, and the consumer will pay it.....but the treasury WILL receive a stream of revenue from that duty, instead of subsidising the EU....and of course, that extra product on cost makes that product having to compete with other imports......so, good old competition comes into play!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patman Post View Post
    I get your overall point, but experience shows the Germans will be able to adapt their pricing through efficiencies if required. Personal observation convinces me the same will be true of other EU manufacturers. It's exports from the UK into the EU that will be more likely to suffer...
    EU wise, undoubtedly - (as will EU exports to the UK).....however, the UK WILL be able to offset much of that via the potential to advantageously export to many more countries than the 27 and you shouldn't really believe that benefits of EU membership to the UK is one way traffic........and nor should you , because of this, believe that a mutually advantageous deal will not be agreed.
    Clearly, France and Germany will wish to ensure that the UK do not appear to be better off post Brexit...........but many other countries will not want to cut off their nose to spite their face....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevlin View Post
    EU wise, undoubtedly - (as will EU exports to the UK).....however, the UK WILL be able to offset much of that via the potential to advantageously export to many more countries than the 27 and you shouldn't really believe that benefits of EU membership to the UK is one way traffic........and nor should you , because of this, believe that a mutually advantageous deal will not be agreed.
    Clearly, France and Germany will wish to ensure that the UK do not appear to be better off post Brexit...........but many other countries will not want to cut off their nose to spite their face....
    We’ve heard all that, but nobody specifies who these countries are that are queuing up to buy UK made goods without strings in the same bulk as EU countries through the nearby ports...
    If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy — DD. The poster also reserves the right to amend or completely change any opinions he has posted at any time...

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