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Thread: Nigel Farage: "Jewish" lobby has disproportionate power in the US

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by uganda View Post
    I suggest you try to stop seeing people as blocs according to religion, nationality etc.
    I will when people will stop identifying themselves as religious and national blocs.
    «The Muslims refuse our culture and try to impose their culture on us. I reject them, and this is not only my duty toward my culture - it is toward my values, my principles, my civilization.» - Oriana Fallaci

  2. #22
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    Benacus, I note you mention Goldman-Sachs as being a company you regard as some Jewish entity controlling large amounts of wealth and power. You are right that some of its executives are Jewish but the companies wealth is owned by institutions (68%) and Public and other investors (30%). The CEO (Lloyd Blankfein) is jewish from a jewish family but seems to deserve his position being born in the Bronx and getting a superior education and qualifications from Harvard College and Harvard Law School. He is worth about $1B.

    If jews are over-represented in US financial and other businesses it is probably because of the historic reasons I mentioned in an earlier post and because they have a good tradition of valuing education. Where I do believe there has been over-representation of jewish interests has been in in the US policies towards Israel and the other countries in the Middle East. But here there has been an alliance of jewish and some Christian groups who both have religious reasons that drive their political views on these issues and these are over-represented in the higher echelons of US politics.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benacus View Post
    I will when people will stop identifying themselves as religious and national blocs.
    Do what you like, but you are doomed to be wrong most of the time. You identify as an Italian - why would I make judgments about you because of that? I make judgments about you because of what you write, nothing else.
    It's amazing how common this narcissism is: I disagree with person A, and I also disagree with person B, therefore A and B are identical - Daniel Hannan

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    Quote Originally Posted by uganda View Post
    Do what you like, but you are doomed to be wrong most of the time. You identify as an Italian - why would I make judgments about you because of that? I make judgments about you because of what you write, nothing else.
    Yes i do identify in one or more groups of people, but Nigel Farage mentions a lobby. I'm not part of any lobby - and most certainly i do not seek to obtain profit at the expenses of others. That's the difference between "groups" and "lobbies" of people.
    «The Muslims refuse our culture and try to impose their culture on us. I reject them, and this is not only my duty toward my culture - it is toward my values, my principles, my civilization.» - Oriana Fallaci

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    Quote Originally Posted by Benacus View Post
    Yes i do identify in one or more groups of people, but Nigel Farage mentions a lobby. I'm not part of any lobby - and most certainly i do not seek to obtain profit at the expenses of others. That's the difference between "groups" and "lobbies" of people.
    Fair enough as that takes us back to the OP and it is a good distinction. But the conversation had expanded from that and I was talking in more general terms about 'groups' because you consistently make judgments about them too, and that is what I think condemns you. Because then, when you come to criticise a Jewish lobby, or Muslim or Christian lobby if you wanted, your prejudices against the wider group, where it applies, affects how clearly you think about the 'lobbies'.
    It's amazing how common this narcissism is: I disagree with person A, and I also disagree with person B, therefore A and B are identical - Daniel Hannan

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by uganda View Post
    Fair enough as that takes us back to the OP and it is a good distinction. But the conversation had expanded from that and I was talking in more general terms about 'groups' because you consistently make judgments about them too, and that is what I think condemns you. Because then, when you come to criticise a Jewish lobby, or Muslim or Christian lobby if you wanted, your prejudices against the wider group, where it applies, affects how clearly you think about the 'lobbies'.
    Depends on the goal the lobby seeks to achieve. I would not object a lobby against poverty, with individuals investing money and efforts to alleviate the plight of the poor. But coincidently enough, all the lobbies i've mentioned have no goal other than profit at the expenses of nations and peoples. Individuals like George Soros are the perfect example of why lobbies are bad when they identify in a religious or industrial group (or both, sometimes).
    «The Muslims refuse our culture and try to impose their culture on us. I reject them, and this is not only my duty toward my culture - it is toward my values, my principles, my civilization.» - Oriana Fallaci

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