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Thread: Fire and Fury the world has never seen

  1. #41
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    Not so.

    Armies like our and the yanks are veteran.
    This means the leaders are combat tested and weak ones already gone.
    They also know what to expect. The ones that panic or freeze or run.. they are already identified and gone.

    It is normal that when a green army meets a veteran army that the green army takes massive casualties.
    Cf Saving private Ryan opening scene.

    Both NK army and Chinese army are green.
    I think I've already mentioned the Oughars of Xinyang.
    Green armies, meeting veteran armies, take massive casualties.

    The difference I am aiming you at is the difference between invading Iraq or Germany where the population surrenders when it is beat, or facing Japan. Where the fight is to the death, man woman and child. And suicide otherwise.

    A fanatacial army.
    North Koreans are fanatics. Scarey boys.

    Chinese are not fanatics. They are precious only children. Mummy's boys.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baff View Post
    If they nuke it before, then they win. the problem is, can they?
    Armies move pretty fast.

    So while in the Cold war our troops in Germany were given 3 bullets and told... don't worry you will be nuked by then, the Russians trained for something else.
    They trained to move so damn ****ing fast as to be in Berlin before you realised. To place themselves in positions you would be unwilling to nuke. As their lives would depend on it.

    And as Kosovo showed us, they can do it too.
    And they trained the Koreans.

    China is a nation of pussies. I have no fear of them as individuals or as armies. Their precious one child. It 's not a risk culture and it has no military tradition or veterans.
    Also NK can nuke them right back of course. But what I am attempting to describe to you is not who wins in a China vs North Korea engagement, because they are allies. What I am attempting to describe to you is the relative effectiveness of NK's fighting force.
    That it isn't a minnow, militarily. It's a tough nut to crack.

    In the Korean War, Brother A rips the head off brother B with his bare hands. And what we suspect Korean govt does to it's dissenters is much worse than what we think the Chinese do. On TV shows, I've seen the Korean kids performing martial arts at school. (BBC did a documentary on Mass Games).
    I fear them.
    Well, my father and i both knew a little about the russians (and the east germans) at the start and the end of the cold war respectively, seeing as how he had a hand in weaponising a few IBM computers for use by our V force at the time Russian and East German Grards were shooting any East Germans who fancied becoming West German and I has a (small) hand through my early work for ferranti in the equipment that would turn west germany into radioactive slag should Honiker order the East Germans to befome West German.... Battlefield Tactical Nuclear Weapons they called them. Nasty stuff.

    And I don't really hold with your analysis of China failing to react to their "best buddy" if they were to march. You don't think they keep an even closer eye on what the mad arse loon is up to than the chaps in Seoul ? And if he were to kick things off and ruin China's current succes at taking over the west by stealth and undercutting all the tenders for supply of internet architecture .... He's be crisped by a Weapon of the Long March family long, long before anything with an Uncle Sam flag entered Korean Airspace.
    --
    "The Inland Revenue is not slow, and quite rightly, to take every advantage which is open to it under the Taxing Statutes for the purposes of depleting the taxpayer's pocket. And the taxpayer is in like manner entitled to be astute to prevent, so far as he honestly can, the depletion of his means by the Inland Revenue"

    Lord Clyde: "Ayrshire Pullman Motor Services V Inland Revenue, 1929"

  3. #43
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    Was listening today to radio 4 in the car today tuned in part way through so don't know the name,anyway various political subjects and various callers till some duffer phoned in to say we should start by apologising to the north Koreans for the damage inflicted in the Korean War.

    Sod that iirc correctly they invaded the south,war is brutal and **** happens so I'm afraid they'd wait a long time for an apology from me,this reminds me of all those who complain about what bomber command did,again I say sod them if you launch blitzkrieg the bombing and destruction of so many allied cities and total war then as Churchill said if you sow the wind you will reap the whirlwind and if loon attacks Guam that is what will happen.
    A lie gets halfway round the world before the truth can get its trousers on.

  4. #44
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    @ john
    For me that seems to be wishful thinking, about as likely as America nuking Israel.

    I agree that China would react to an NK invasion, but not so successfully, I'm thinking. And not "at any price".

    China and Russia are both on America's list too.
    And it is better to fight your wars in someone else's country than in your own.
    Korea is a buffer zone, the traditional fault line between empires that kicks off again and again and again in history. Ukraine is another one.
    Those countries are doomed to war. North and south Korea were born out of this relationship. It's why they exist as nations at all.
    We and our enemies made them. It is the essence of this dispute.

    China is building up to face America in the Pacific, the money they are earning is being spent on that.
    America is a common threat to all three countries.

    He's had nukes for ten years and always had the capability to strike America with them. So that is a pretext only.
    Like Tony Blairs... Iraq has nukes and can nuke GB in 45 minutes from now.

    It's bollocks talk. The usual excuse.
    China and Russia are the US's strategic goal and NK is part of that.
    China and Russia know this full well.

    You can't buy China with the very money it is lending you. Chinese people are quite sharp.

    @ Cromwell spot on. Enemy is enemy. **** em.
    You will feel guilty afterwards, live with it.

  5. #45
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    I wasn't aware the Indians were on North Korea's side in the Korean war. And the war never formally ended.

    What do you call a man who sent cabinet ministers to entice the citizens of an ally of a country formally at war with us since 1953 and granted them access to work on our most vital military systems...
    --
    "The Inland Revenue is not slow, and quite rightly, to take every advantage which is open to it under the Taxing Statutes for the purposes of depleting the taxpayer's pocket. And the taxpayer is in like manner entitled to be astute to prevent, so far as he honestly can, the depletion of his means by the Inland Revenue"

    Lord Clyde: "Ayrshire Pullman Motor Services V Inland Revenue, 1929"

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