View Poll Results: Which Theory do you believe in ?

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  • Evolution

    22 73.33%
  • Creationism

    1 3.33%
  • Intelligent Design

    2 6.67%
  • Other - Please specify

    3 10.00%
  • A mixture of the above

    2 6.67%
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Thread: Half of Britons reject evolution, survey finds

  1. #871
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    Quote Originally Posted by T00ts View Post
    Mmm - No I think that's too simplistic. In Thessalonians it refers to those asleep (ie dead). For me it seems just logical. I cannot believe that a just God would arrange a system where those born outside Christianity would suffer by birth. What about all those who died before Christ came to earth? Questions questions....!
    I really don't know. God will do what He wants. God is a God of love and also a God of judgement. Some people would say he was unjust in destroying all but a few people in a flood. Others might say he was unjust in asking the Israelites to totally wipe out their enemies. You might say he is unjust in not saving those who never heard the Gospel.
    He says, "My ways are not your ways", so it's difficult to know.
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  2. #872
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    I really don't know. God will do what He wants. God is a God of love and also a God of judgement. Some people would say he was unjust in destroying all but a few people in a flood. Others might say he was unjust in asking the Israelites to totally wipe out their enemies. You might say he is unjust in not saving those who never heard the Gospel.
    He says, "My ways are not your ways", so it's difficult to know.
    I would agree with your last sentence but my thoughts on His anger and the way He manifests it is that He gives/gave us rules. We have a choice. The consequences of those decisions are always manifest in some way - hence Noah's story. He forgives repeatedly but at some point we are subject to those consequences. As you say 'His ways' but also in His time, neither of which we can yet understand within this human body.
    ...till I die I will not remove mine integrity from me, xx

  3. #873
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    A belief in a creator is the default position for the human race. It has to be from a reasonable and logical perspective.

    To move from the default position you have to have proof to do so.

  4. #874
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    Quote Originally Posted by T00ts View Post
    Surely if life is eternal (there we agree?) then personal development must be so as well. So doesn't it follow that somewhere between death and resurrection and judgement there is space for acceptance of Jesus Christ? Jesus said He was the way, but if someone doesn't get that chance in life it seems a bit unfair to penalise them for eternity.
    There is a lot of truth in what you say. The churches have been wrong on this issue and many others for centuries.

    Rev 20:13 "And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works"

    Hell gives up those dead in it. It is not eternal.

    1 Thess 4:14 "For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep"

    Nor does dead/death = tortured/torture. Its a state of sleep.

  5. #875
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danzo View Post
    There is a lot of truth in what you say. The churches have been wrong on this issue and many others for centuries.

    Rev 20:13 "And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works"

    Hell gives up those dead in it. It is not eternal.

    1 Thess 4:14 "For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep"

    Nor does dead/death = tortured/torture. Its a state of sleep.
    Ah a kindred spirit perhaps?
    ...till I die I will not remove mine integrity from me, xx

  6. #876
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    Quote Originally Posted by T00ts View Post
    Ah a kindred spirit perhaps?
    Could be. I like to read the bible as it's intended. To tell me the truth of the matter. In a way that human beings understand matters. Reasoning and logic. If it's Gods book for mankind then that has to be a basic premise in order to begin to understand it.

    In my experience this attitude towards it is lacking in many places.

  7. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Danzo For This Useful Post:

    Barry (24-03-2019), T00ts (23-03-2019)

  8. #877
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danzo View Post
    A belief in a creator is the default position for the human race. It has to be from a reasonable and logical perspective.

    To move from the default position you have to have proof to do so.
    Who says it’s the default position?
    I can explain it to you, but I canít understand it for you.

  9. #878
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    Who says it’s the default position?
    Logic and reason. The scientific and observable laws about how things are made. The default position is that things make other things.

  10. #879
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    I used to wonder about "Soul sleep" but I searched the scriptures for that and couldn't find anything.
    For instance, Paul says "Absent from the body, present with the Lord" (That is not hell or any holding room!)
    Also, Jesus said to the thief on the cross, "Today you will be with me in paradise". (I always put extra importance on quoted words of Jesus as he is God).
    There's very little evidence of this idea that our souls "sleep" in scripture, unless you chaps and chapesses think you've found something significant.
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  11. #880
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    I used to wonder about "Soul sleep" but I searched the scriptures for that and couldn't find anything.
    For instance, Paul says "Absent from the body, present with the Lord" (That is not hell or any holding room!)
    Also, Jesus said to the thief on the cross, "Today you will be with me in paradise". (I always put extra importance on quoted words of Jesus as he is God).
    There's very little evidence of this idea that our souls "sleep" in scripture, unless you chaps and chapesses think you've found something significant.
    'In my Father's house are many mansions...' In my mind they are all a paradise, but it does suggest that not everyone will live eternally in the same place. I believe that judgement of how we have lived and believed will determine where in eternal life/paradise we will live. My logic says that until that decision we will be somewhere else. Surely all is not complete until everything is finished - the 2nd coming and everything that follows. All those who have passed and are currently in spirit must be somewhere - waiting, learning and developing.

    I quite like being a chapess!
    ...till I die I will not remove mine integrity from me, xx

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